These are mostly pretty flimsy arguments. For example: Zelensky did beat the coup-installed candidate, but he did so on a platform of being more conciliatory to Russia (not surprising, he barely spoke Ukrainian). Once he got into office, however, he pivoted to a platform that was very similar to the coup candidate’s, suggesting that the coup was about more than changing who held one single office.
Secondly: Ukraine does not have a “Nazi problem”, in the sense that the Ukrainian government finds it to be a problem. They had 8 years from the coup to the invasion to do something about the Nazis and they did: They helped them. It was around then that Azov was formed, and over time Azov went from being a paramilitary to an actual Ukrainian military battalion, to an influential force across Ukraine’s military. It was also the coup government, Zelensky included, that decided the thing to do would be heighten state worship of Holocaust perpetrator Stepan Bandera, and now Ukraine has Banderites in pretty high offices.
Azov aren’t a threat because they can invade Russia and win, they are a threat because they have been given immense power in the Ukrainian military and therefore the government. Anyone with eyes can see that Zelensky has a gun to his back, and based on how he has acted in brash defiance of his western handlers, it seems like an inevitable conclusion that it’s the domestic fascists holding the gun.
Someone used to have some clear evidence of the shelling of the Donbas ratcheting up from Ukr side in the days before the invasion. I haven’t seen it posted in a while, but it was from some international monitoring org showing how the Ukr side was being very accelerationist. I’ll see if I can dig it up.
e: not what I was thinking of, but provides similar context, this interview in French, the translated part below:
spoiler
Specifically, on Friday, the OSCE identifies 1,800 violations of the peace agreements by Ukraine, with heavy-arm shelling, which are prohibited by the Geneva Conventions and international law. On Saturday, 19 February 2022, the Donbas authorities, in agreement with Russia, evacuated 100,000 people across the border in order to protect them from Ukrainian bombing. Moreover, hundreds of buses can be seen on the roads. At that time, it is also discovered that there are more than 100,000 Ukrainian soldiers who are massed on the banks of the Donbass and who are ready to fight them. Frankly, when we also heavily bombard the civilian population, it is because we are preparing something behind us. In addition, there is article 61 of the Constitution of the Russian Federation, which is very short, which says that the Russian Federation must protect and assist Russian citizens abroad. In Donbass, however, many people have dual nationality. International law obliges Vladimir Putin to intervene, as does his own constitution. When we bomb civilian populations, international law requires the intervention of neighbours. However, this famous week, I have not heard the UN Secretary General worry about what the civilian population is going to suffer, I have not heard the NATO Secretary General intervene, I have not heard Mrs Von der Leyen, or President Macron, when they are supposed to guarantee the peace agreements. If a State attacks the civilian population, the international community must intervene, so I consider the Ukrainian State to be the aggressor and that the neighbouring State must intervene to protect the civilian population. I would add that 20 February 2022 is also a very interesting day. President zelensky is invited to the famous Munich Security Conference and will explain that he wants to break the Budapest protocol in order to have nuclear weapons on its territory. Over the weekend, the OSCE will continue to record 3,000 ceasefire violations. At that time, there are Ukrainian forces firing, but also the Donbas republics defending themselves. On Sunday, Vladimir Putin begins the process of recognizing the two republics and the presidents of the two republics are invited to Moscow the next day to sign aid treaties. I thought it was a good thing, because it was a sign of de-escalation because, until then, attacking the Donbass, by the Ukrainians, was attacking Ukrainian civilian populations. This time, one might have thought that the Ukrainians were going to be careful, because now they would also attack Russia. But not at all, it is still in the OSCE reports that everyone can read, the OSCE continues to record 1,700 ceasefire violations on Monday and Tuesday. Now, we are in my interpretation, Russia has understood that the Minsk agreements have lapsed. We must not forget this statement by Angela Merkel and François Hollande that Ukraine needed to be given time to arm it.
You are probably thinking a Ken Klippenstein substack post.
Edit: it isnt ken klippenstein. But another journalist. I always confuse the two of them. The one whose post I THINK you are talking about joined The Grayzone recently.
Edit2: it is this post https://www.kitklarenberg.com/p/civil-war-in-donbass-10-years-on
it is this post https://www.kitklarenberg.com/p/civil-war-in-donbass-10-years-on
I think it was some screenshots from the OSCE report here: https://www.osce.org/special-monitoring-mission-to-ukraine/512683
I can’t get your link to load at the moment, but maybe that was the source of these screenshots or had similar analysis.
What do they mean that Putin provided no evidence of genocide by Euromaiden coup government in Ukraine? Do they mean that the Pax Americana authoritarianism is censoring all evidence of genocide by Kyiv government? Do they mean that the person who claimed that Putin provided no evidences decide to not look for evidence?
my thoughts are that im glad i dont use reddit anymore.
This is lemmy.ml
lol
TBH, I think ‘genocide’ is an overstatement. There definitely was an antifascist uprising and Ukrainian government’s attempt to suppress it.
“Genocide” is only an overstatement IMO because the Donbass had the means to defend themselves on some level. It was still a campaign of terror and bombardment, with what could be described as pogroms, massacres, and a whole lot of hate crimes as well as government-instituted discrimination against the ethnic Russians and other minorities in Ukraine.
If what constantly occurs against indigenous peoples in the Anglosphere is considered a genocide, which it should be, then the attacks on ethnic Russian, Roma, Caucasian (from the Caucasus), etc. peoples in Ukraine certainly should fit the bill.
Any white, west-European descended people getting even a tenth of the Donbass and ethnic Russian treatment would be crying “genocide” about it forever. Hell, just look at the Rhodesians or the constant fearmongering (and settlers claiming decolonization is “genocide”) etc.
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I’m not in the mood to read this one, but I’ll point to my previous lemmy.ml copypasta which may be relevant, and draws from imperial core corporate media’s own publications. One more bit in terms of “cultural” genocide, which is part of the Geneva Convention’s conceptualization: Why Ukraine’s new language law will have long-term consequences
Is there evidence of genocide? Because this source says otherwise.
I think it has been established that the Russian invasion happened because Putin didn’t want a western oriented Ukraine that could possibly have meant an eastward expansion of NATO. Defending indefensible claims just hurts this consensus imo
This user has compiled some sources
Oh yeah that guy 😉 He’s sure accumulated some walls-o’-links.
I actually bookmarked that when you pointed to it. Thank you because it grows tiresome looking for Western MSM links every time someone fed the liberal narrative demands a source and they’re certainly not accepting otherwise, and as you can see, often not Western MSM.
Do you have a source on the Donbas genocide?
It sounds like you’re looking for one singular article/document that provides irrefutable proof. If there is one, I haven’t come across it. The evidence is in Ukraine’s actions over the last decade to erase ethnic Russians from its country, physically or culturally. Whether that ends up being considered de jure genocide is up to the ICJ.
There’s nothing on a genocide so ty for bringing my point home.
Talk of uyghur genocide or donbas genocide just weakens the term tbh
‘uyghur genicide’ is a straightforward category error because China isn’t doing anything like what western sources claim. ‘donbas genocide’ is a matter for debate and analysis following a well documented and targeted attack, the details of which are yet to be reconciled. I can agree that the latter might not be genocide but it isn’t comparable to Xinjiang.
lemmy.ml is not bad and im sure the Admins of lemmy.ml are Communist the libs from lemmy.world and lemmy.ca infested it I’m actually happy that the admins at lemmy.world defederated Lemmygrad and Hexbear since the libs might have do the same. Source: https://lemmy.world/post/6709939 https://lemmy.world/post/2498330 (yes we could ban them but they would just use alt accounts)
wait how do you get Lemmy on mobile? (Or it just looks mobile to me)
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I use Voyager. It has an option that lets you take replies as pictures as the ones that I showed.
