(Content warning, discussions of SA and misogyny, mods I might mention politics a bit but I hope this can be taken outside the context of politics and understood as a discussion of basic human decency)
We all know how awful Reddit was when a user mentioned their gender. Immediate harassment, DMs, etc. It’s probably improved over the years? But still awful.
Until recently, Lemmy was the most progressive and supportive of basic human dignity of communities I had ever followed. I have always known this was a majority male platform, but I have been relatively pleased to see that positive expressions of masculinity have won out.
All of that changed with the recent “bear vs man” debacle. I saw women get shouted down just for expressing their stories of being sexually abused, repeatedly harassed, dogpiled, and brigaded with downvotes. Some of them held their ground, for which I am proud of them, but others I saw driven to delete their entire accounts, presumably not to return.
And I get it. The bear thing is controversial; we can all agree on this. But that should never have resulted in this level of toxicity!
I am hoping by making this post I can kind of bring awareness to this weakness, so that we can learn and grow as a community. We need to hold one another accountable for this, or the gender gap on this site is just going to get worse.
Yes, mods in most communities expect discussions not to descend into people hurling insults at each other because that turns the community into chaos and also does not make it a safe place for marginalized groups and why you would be against such a policy to the point of being so rude to me, I’m not sure. But if you feel that you need a place where you can be as insulting towards people as you like, may I suggest 4chan?
How is “may I suggest 4chan”, a notoriously transphobic website, directed at someone from the Trans Lemmy, not supposed to be an insult?
How is “fuck you” an insult? It doesn’t attack you in any way whatsoever it just shows disrespect. I’m allowed to not respect you. Didn’t say anything about you or even call you an asshole.
You’re not protecting marginalized groups, you’re enforcing a standard of civility that is usually used to tell minorities “shut up, why are you so angry”
If protecting minorities was the goal, the rule would be against racism, sexism, etc… but that’s not the rule.
I already explained several times why I’m against the policy but idk I guess you can’t read that well? Really the only explanation I have here.
That is stated explicitly in the communities I moderate.
Examples-
World News:
Ten Forward:
Lemmy Shitpost:
I don’t know what you are entitled to do in this community in terms of moderation, but you are not entitled to make up your own so-called facts unchallenged.
Okay, if the civility rule is in place to protect minorities as you say, than why would we need a civility rule? That’s my point. We already have rules against bigotry.
You totally missed my point 🙄 and then you get all snooty about “facts unchallenged”. When really you just continually misunderstand or ignore my very clearly spelled out argument against this dumbass civility rule. Is this civility? You’re just ignoring all my points and posting useless screenshots.
Your words:
I showed that this was a false claim.
So you can say I missed your point, but your point was based on a false claim. And now you’re moving the goalposts.
I said “that’s not the rule”, not “that’s not a rule”. As in, that’s not the rule you’re talking about. You’re literally just misunderstanding me, probably deliberately, and ignoring all my points to focus on pedantics! This is why you suck so bad dude!
You’re ignoring the topic at hand to focus on something that you misinterpreted. Embarassing for you. Can’t believe you’re trying to turn this discussion into a grammar lesson, rather than the fact that your enforcement of civility rules is a shit thing to do.
So back to the topic, if civility rules exist to defend minorities, which is what you claimed … why do we need them if we already have rules against bigotry and hate speech!!!
And also back to the topic, how is continuing to ignore the conversation to rudely insist on your incorrect interpretation of my clear words… even after I clarified … how is that civil lmao
I’m still not understanding why it’s a shitty thing to stop people from having shouting matches and being bigots, which is what the civility rules are for, and you keep being rude rather than explaining it.
But it seems like you are not a fan of the ‘no shouting matches’ part, which seems to be the problem. And, again, I would suggest 4Chan if you want endless shouting matches.
I’ve explained multiple times, and if you had bothered to engage with my points rather than ignore them completely you would understand. Another poster also wrote out several paragraphs explaining why. You are PRETENDING to not have seen these explanations I wrote out.
Civility rules focus on the tone rather than the content, which is highly problematic because marginalized groups are often rightfully pissed the fuck off. That’s probably like, the fifth time I’ve written out a version of that.
You are bringing up 4chan again after I already told you that that’s fucked up since it’s an extremely transphobic site, and I am a trans person. That’s not civil lmao. You can continually insult me by telling me to go to 4chan, but if I say “fuck you” I gety posts taken down. Make that make sense. Nah, you won’t because you get off on the power trip.
I have seen how you operate multiple times. You get into arguments with people, nitpick over dumb shit, and then when someone gets frustrated and uses meanie-poopoo-head language you take out your moderation powers. You have done this to me and I’ve seen you do this in other threads to other users. You really suck dude.
Then feel free to flag my post for violating incivility rules. Maybe I’ll be banned. You seem to think I’m a moderator in this community when I’m not.