dont even need to watch the video fr i fuck with the title, outer wilds fuckin slapped especially bc you can only play it once lmao, remove progression systems from games
I played a lot of Hades because the play cycle was fun, and getting good was enjoyable. But once I finished the story, and I romanced who I wanted to romance, I’ve never picked it up again. And I like it that way.
i liked hades but i would have liked it better with less “+10 health/+10 damage” type metaprogression tbh, something like FTL where you’re mostly unlocking sidegrades and new gameplay options instead of straight upgrades alongside the narrative
i like how the video contrasts the addictive MMO style shitfest with the “addictive” actually fun Vampire Survivors. it’s nice to see people separate out dopamine fests from, y’know, addictive and unenjoyable dopamine fasts (not a typo) that are MMOs. Because like, who doesn’t love a good dopamine fest
edit: the word for something that’s so good that you can’t put it down is “compelling”, i don’t know why it just isn’t used to describe games?? (except stories in them)
“Addiction is a specific thing that requires biological dependency therefore you said the wrong word and everything you said is invalid!” 
I posted that there so pedants don’t have to.
I absolutely hate that argument, it would mean gambling addiction is not real. In other words: one of the most harmful addictions to public health is not an addiction by that definition, because there’s no “biological dependency”.
Skinner box game mechanics suck and are just hollow “entertainment” but are manufactured very carefully to maximise fomo and engagement. They’re very profitable though which is ofc why its used, battle passes, timed events, seasonal content, lIvE sErVicE shite.
It’s designed specifically to prey on people who are vulnerable to these tactics, I even fell into it myself around the modern warfare reboot getting extremely worked up over battle passes. Hated every minute of it but just couldn’t stop myself until someone hacked my Activision account and stole it breaking me out of the cycle.
Fukn crapitalism.
Skinner box game mechanics suck and are just hollow “entertainment”
All Vidya Gamez are fundamentally Skinner Boxes. At the same time, when you’re trapped in a cube all day, it’s nice to get a food pellet. Stop shaming people for food pelleting themselves.
Hated every minute of it but just couldn’t stop myself until someone hacked my Activision account and stole it breaking me out of the cycle.
My original experience with online games was in a big social circle that whittled away over time. It’s less the game pass model itself (which always just descends into “How much pop culture can we shove into your generic Blood Gulch shooter/looter?”) than the fact that I’m playing with an endless parade of anonymous that nobodies I ultimately find so upsetting.
I play chess with a co-worker every lunch break we’re free, and it’s far more fun and fulfilling than the time I spent grinding amid a sea of faceless nobodies.
At the same time, it feels cruel to tell people who don’t have an active social circle to just not be online at all.
The only thing worse than the Skinner Box is solitary confinement.
All Vidya Gamez are fundamentally Skinner Boxes.
No they are not and I will fight you. If you mean multiplayer online games, well maybe, you might have a point, but I don’t play those games and so I will make no claims about them.
However. If you call Outer Wilds or Pathologic/Pathologic 2 or Disco Elysium or A Short Hike or Journey skinner boxes, well, you’re just wrong. Games are experiences, they’re stories that can be more immersive than a movie or a book and if they’re done well, holy shit are they good!
Games are (can be) amazing, and I’m sick of pretending they’re not.
Games are experiences, they’re stories that can be more immersive than a movie or a book and if they’re done well, holy shit are they good!
They’re still feedback loops of input and reward. That the reward is “compelling narrative” rather than “loud ding with big number go up” changes the quality of the treat dispensed but not the nature of the box.
Games are (can be) amazing
Skinner Boxes are tools to gauge the behaviors of their subjects.
The form can still be artistic and the reward for interaction can be sublime and the thing itself can still be what it is.
do you think a novel is a skinner box
No. There’s no human input that determines the response.
Goosebumps choose your own adventure novels.
But to take you a tiny bit more seriously, ok? So what? Why does “I have some agency in this story” make a story bad? What actually are you getting at here?
Goosebumps choose your own adventure novels.
Primitive, but closer to the mark.
So what? Why does “I have some agency in this story” make a story bad?
I don’t think it does. The box is just a mechanism. In the same way that a book or a painting can be good or bad, a gameplay loop can, too.
What actually are you getting at here?
You can have a Beautiful Skinner Box in the same way you can have a Van Gogh or a Tolstoy novel.
